20 February 2008

Suscipiat Dominus

May the Lord accept the sacrifice at your hands for the praise and glory of His name, for our good and the good of all His Church.

Another example of heterodoxy at St. Augustine's... I was at Mass today and I overheard someone say in response to the Orate Fratres, "May the Lord accept the sacrifice at your hands for the praise and glory of God's name, for our good and the good of all God's Church." Of course, I cannot know the intentions of this person in changing this prayer, but I think I may take a stab at it.

The person changed the masculine pronoun 'His' to 'God's'. The prayers of the Mass are given to us to pray, not to change willy nilly. One also wonders, with the Women's Book Club and their feminist agenda, with Sister Rose Hoover of the Cenacle arguing for women's ordination, etc.... about the mind of some who would try to sneak inclusive language into the Mass. Lord have mercy.

Also, at Newman Dinner tonight, Anders tried to make an announcement about daily Rosary at Plaza of the Americas. He was told by someone in charge that he could not make an announcement about this because it had been made in the past. Apparently, announcements can't be recurring.... if they are about the Rosary. Every week, the Alpha retreat and Nueva Alianza are brought up, yet God forbid that the recitation of the Rosary be promoted. Christ have mercy.

Holy Mary, Mother of God, pray for us.


Anonymous Anonymous said...

You sound like an exceptionally angry kid...and I'm sorry for you.

February 21, 2008 2:22 AM  
Blogger Jonathan Knox said...

Oh no, please don't be sorry for me! I am angry about things like this. The Church is still under attack, by forces external and internal. We are assured, however, that in the end, the Immaculate Heart of Mary will triumph.

If I were seething with anger, I'd probably name names. There's no need for me to do that over a relatively small thing that doesn't create widespread scandal. This anger is in response to the abundance of heresy at St. Augustine's and the local Church. Besides the heretical teachings and practices scattered here and there, much of the remainder is "fluff". The people are not being given the full teachings of Catholicism as they deserve. It is no wonder that many drive 1 hour on Sundays to go elsewhere for nourishment.

And anonymous, if you agree with the nonsense that happens at that church, I'm sorry for you.

February 21, 2008 1:01 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Have you heard of the Christian virtue of humility? Or the command of Jesus not to judge? Or the commandment about bearing false witness?

If you notice that people are leaving comments anonymously, you might wonder why. People may well be concerned about statements which appear to be libelous which you have at times included in your blog, and fear that the same treatment will be accorded them.

"Beati pauperes spiritu quoniam ipsorum est regnum caelorum."

(I am not the "Anonymous" who previously posted.)

February 22, 2008 2:34 PM  
Blogger Jonathan Knox said...

Are you accusing me of not being humble? I will admit that at times I do struggle with humility, but I can't see any lack of humility here in this post. It seems that you are judging, but veiling it by asking rhetorical questions.

I remember Father Mesa very recently gave a homily in which he began saying that we cannot take the Scriptures out of context. I fear, however, that you are taking the command of Jesus to not judge grossly out of context!! First, I am of the lowliest of sinners. When I do err, though, I make quick to go to the Sacrament of Penance. May God continue to grant me the grace to approach this sacrament with humility!

But back to the issue of judging. I am not judging, it is God who judges and His Church that judges. I am but a pathetic instrument. Look to Ezekiel 3:17-19. I do not claim any divine mission to warn people or to bring orthodoxy and orthopraxy back to this church. God has much mightier and holier vessels whom he has called. I am taking up the common call of all the faithful, performing the spiritual works of mercy: admonish the sinner and instruct the ignorant.

I have no problem with people leaving comments anonymously. It doesn't affect me. I can guess as to who everyone is, anyways. The fear is more like these people do not want to have a clear trail of dissent leading back to them. I have never written anything about anyone without having first hand knowledge of the fact.

But thank you for writing, and thank you for the lovely Latin from the beatitudes. Could we hear some Latin in the parish? Happy Feast of the Chair of Saint Peter to you! May we always remain in perfect unity with that chair! Also, you know me by face, so if you'd ever like to grab me and chat, I'd love to oblige!

Judica me, Deus, et discerne causam meam de gente non sancta: ab homine iniquo et doloso erue me.

February 22, 2008 3:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I was messing around online and ran into your blog. Its interesting. Just one comment on this post I speak latin and spanish and the problem with your reasoning is that in spanish su and in latin sui is genderless, while in english Him is obviously not. So there is actually no gender actually specifically stated in the original latin or spanish version of that line. Did you also know that the Church as in the Catholic Church in latin (Ecclesiae) and spanish (Iglesia) the gender of both words in feminine. Isnt that interesting. I mean i just wanted to add some interesting things to an already interesting blog.

February 23, 2008 5:56 PM  
Blogger Jonathan Knox said...

Thank you, Anonymous, for stopping by!!

I appreciate your comments on the original language for the liturgy. This brings up an important point, as Liturgicam Authenticam says that vernacular translations of the juxta typica must be faithful translations of the Latin.

I must disagree with your reasoning, though. The Suscipiat Dominus is a response to the Orate Fratres, which says "Orate fratres, ut meum ac vestrum sacrificium acceptabile fiat apud Deum Patrem omnipotentem." It is a prayer directed to God the Father.

This is all besides the point, as the official translation which is approved for use in English speaking countries, clearly says HIS. There is no allowance for HER. If Rome wanted an allowance, they would make one, as they do for the Orate Frates. The priest may say, "Pray brethren/brothers and sisters/dear friends..." We must pray what the Church has us pray.

February 23, 2008 6:55 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Not really sure about humility. Don't see much of it in your blog, don't not see much of it here. Not sure that someone full of humility would claim to the be lowliest of sinners.

You have created a lot of food for thought though and I think that is something from which we can all benefit.

You are in good company though, we're all sinners and we all judge, none of us could claim to be perfect. Such disgrace if we did.

Thanks for the blog, keep up the stimulating conversations.

Here's some food for though - how much of your faith do you put into action? Do you show your love of Christ in serving the poor? It often seems that people that know the Church in and out spend too much time wrapped up in words and put none of their faith translates to action. When was the last time you helped someone truly in need and let Christ burst through you in service to another? You certainly don't have to answer here. Just think and pray about it.

Further enliven your Eucharistic experience. Ite missa est. Don't forget the ite is an imperative.

February 23, 2008 11:08 PM  
Blogger Jonathan Knox said...

Well I never said I was full of humility, nor that I was the lowliest of sinners.

But you are right, we are all sinners and we all need to admonish each other when we see each other go wrong. Thank you for writing!

Yes, we are obliged to take what is given to us and share it with the world. Unfortunately, I'm for the most part restricted to campus, so I can't do much active work outside. I would love to help at a homeless shelter. Let's not forget that there are also the spiritual works of mercy. This blog is in effect my attempt at fulfilling some of these works- to instruct the ignorant. As a student, it's easier for me to pray for others and use this medium rather than visit the sick or the poor. So to answer your question, I'm trying to live out my faith. We can never do enough, though. Let's pray for each other that we may evermore increase in our faith and works. God bless!

February 23, 2008 11:27 PM  
Blogger Jonathan Knox said...

*Laughing at the crazy amount of Latin in this series of posts* I love it!

February 24, 2008 3:17 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

[I'm the "Anonymous" from February 22.]

You wrote: "you know me by face." No, the only way I know what you look like is from the photo on your blog.

You wrote: "It seems that you are judging..." Please forgive me for sounding judgmental of you. After all, your life and your actions may well reveal more compassion and humility than your posts indicate. Unfortunately, your posts are what the world sees of you. For a zealous young Catholic, I do pray for more than what I see here. May you be abundantly blessed as you grow in your spiritual life.

Just a caution: These posts may come back to haunt you if a future employer or graduate school admissions committee ever googles you.

February 24, 2008 9:49 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...


I've been reading your blog for a little while and finally decided to comment.

First off, congratulations on being received into the Catholic Church! The faith we share is a wonderful way to get to know the Lord! I pray that you continue to grow in it and broaden your understanding of it, and most of all, that you continue to grow closer to He who is Lord of all.

In reading your blog, there seems to be some bitterness (or at least defensiveness) on both sides. Let us all remember, no matter which opinion we choose, what we say in the Creed each Sunday: that we believe in one, holy Catholic and apostolic church (unam, sanctam, catholicam et apostolicam, I believe, since we seem to have so many Latin fans out there - although my Latin is a little rusty). Our Catechism teaches us to embrace differences within our faith:

814: From the beginning, this one Church has been marked by a great diversity which comes from both the variety of God's gifts and the diversity of those who receive them. Within the unity of the People of God, a multiplicity of peoples and cultures is gathered together.... The great richness of such diversity is not opposed to the Church's unity. Yet sin and the burden of its consequences constantly threaten the gift of unity. And so the Apostle has to exhort Christians to "maintain the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace."

And what an exhortation that is! We should all be attentive to it.

Again, the Catechism emphasizes this:

835: Let us be careful not to conceive of the universal Church as the simple sum, or... the more or less anomalous federation of essentially different particular churches. In the mind of the Lord the Church is universal by vocation and mission, but when she puts down her roots in a variety of cultural, social, and human terrains, she takes on different external expressions and appearances in each part of the world. The rich variety of ecclesiastical disciplines, liturgical rites, and theological and spiritual heritages proper to the local churches "unified in a common effort, shows all the more resplendently the catholicity of the undivided Church."

In a Church with such diversity there are bound to be differences of opinion amongst us, as much as Jesus exhorts us to get along. Let us remember when we get frustrated with each other how many ways there are to love.

Our Lord shows Himself in so many different ways. Do you see more Him in the Tridentine Mass, rich in tradition, or in the Novus Ordo Mass, striving for accessability? Either one, seek Him there! Do you hear Him in organ music, in chant, in traditional hymns, or in guitars and Marty Haugen music and African spirituals? Either or both, listen to Him there! Do you feel his Love poured out for you in the words of the Divine Mercy Chaplet, in the rosary in honor of our Blessed Mother, in the Stations of the Cross? Seek Him there as well! Do you see His face in the Saints, in men and women religious, in other people, in the poor, in your friends? Reach out and touch Him there!

At the Eucharistic table we are united; from there let us take the love the Lord gives us and spread it in a multitude of ways! Let us taste and see our Lord in the Eucharist and from there, learn to see Him everywhere else He is.

February 25, 2008 11:05 PM  
Blogger Jonathan Knox said...


Thank you for your kind words. It is a great joy to finally be in full communion with Christ's Church!

I agree that there is room for differences in opinion, and even to some extent, there is room for some variety in expressions of worship. Just a side note on the Marty Haugen and African spirituals- I really don't see much room for these in Mass, as most of them contain ambiguities and sometimes outright contradictions with the Catholic faith, though I believe there are some that have their merits. But just a side note!

It is essential that we be united in love. "I love my neighbor for the love of thee" St. Augustine said "In essentials, unity, in doubtful things, liberty, and in all things charity." The point I am trying to make is that we must find out what are the essentials. Holy Mass is the most essential- and we can't change the words of the Mass. Also, in doctrine that has been set forth by the Magisterium- there is no room for dissent.

But yes, let us pray that charity may prevail in all things.

February 26, 2008 12:26 AM  
Blogger Anthony said...

A note for the anonymous publishers:

Just last night John and I were discussing this troubling topic of anonymous letters, which are cowardly and diabolical in many ways. We are left to wonder who wrote these letters, who on earth wrote them, and then we suspect everyone. Our eyes are soiled by a tendency to seek out faults. Whatever eloquent words may be posted, in anonymity they become callous signs of cowardice, judgment, and condescencion ("I'm hidden behind this veil of anonymity so I'll say some extra poignant (perhaps harsh) stuff!").

Remember Christ's words,
"If your brother sins, go and show him his fault in private; if he listens to you, you have won your brother. But if he does not listen to you, take one or two more with you, so that BY THE MOUTH OF TWO OR THREE WITNESSES EVERY FACT MAY BE CONFIRMED. If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church; and if he refuses to listen even to the church, let him be to you as a Gentile and a tax collector." (Matt 18:15-17)

As a person who used to feel intense urges to write condemning anonymous letters and who still at times would prefer the ease of doing so, I can vouch to the evilness of such letters. I have, however, vowed to never write one again and so far have not done so.

Now, there is a tendency these days to consider any sort of admonition or uncovering of malice as judgment or being judgmental. I must say I have never seen such a puerile display of inability to accept one's faults in my life. It is like a little child crying to his mommy because his teacher told him to study harder because of bad grades. I mean, c'mon people. Admonishing someone for their sins or speaking of the Faith candidly and sincerely is not being judgmental. If I say, "Timmy, you're doing a bad thing by encouraging your girlfriend to have an abortion" that is not judgment, it is admonition. Now if I say, "Timmy, you're a bad person", that IS judgment and it is evil IF unbacked by a very legitimate reason. Judgments of that sort are best avoided for our sake. However times do call for saying such things where it would not enter the realm of rash judgment, which is condemned by the Catechism. To say that Dr. So-and-so the abortionist is an accomplice to euthanasia and is complicit in evil is very much a legitimate judgment backed by the firm knowledge that he has euthanized people.

It is time we stop whining about judgment or blaming others for being judgmental as a cover up for the illicit, erroneous, or disobedient practices of undisciplined Catholics. Catholicism entails obedience and humility, which means accepting legitimate judgments and admonitions when one has done wrong.

And my name is ANTHONY PIFERRER of Gainesville, Florida. I approve of the contents of this message.

February 26, 2008 6:14 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I think the discussion you are generating by your blog is great. One thing it shows is that you and others are concerned about the Church - goodness knows we could all have much worse habits.

I don't know if I agree with all of the personal philosophies or interpretations I read here (yours and others). However, you should be commended for starting and engaging some very, very thoughtful conversation.

I don't think anonymity matters in the case of a blog, perhaps the anonymity is creating better discussion than there would be otherwise. Additionally, it seems that you continue to accept anonymous postings, so you must be willing to hear what others have to say, whether or not you know them - that takes some serious courage.

Bottom line - the conversation should continue and you've opened up a wonderful forum for discussion, and perhaps conversion as well. I'm delighted to see the latin, and further delighted that some even know how to use the Catechism of the Catholic Church - what a beautiful thing.

I pray for your continued growth in faith. And also, welcome to the Catholic Church.

February 26, 2008 7:21 PM  

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